And while we’re on the subject of voting, should you have to show a photo ID in order to be able to cast a ballot? On Wednesday, the Supreme Court will be asked to decide.
Wednesday’s Christian Science Monitor has the story:
In 2005, the Indiana state legislature passed a law requiring all voters to show government-issued photo identification before being allowed to cast a ballot.
State officials promoted the measure as protection against voter fraud. Opponents denounced it as a thinly veiled attempt to suppress Democratic voter turnout in Indiana.
On Wednesday, the issue arrives at the US Supreme Court where the justices are being asked to decide whether requiring would-be voters to show photo ID violates the right to vote.
The case is being closely watched because it could establish new constitutional benchmarks in advance of the approaching 2008 general elections….
The McClatchy story on this same issue cites a study estimating that “13 percent of lndiana’s more than 4 million registered voters lack the required ID.”
Democrats and civil rights groups charge that the law is a Republican ploy to prevent thousands of poor, elderly and minority citizens from casting ballots.
Republicans say that it won’t prevent any qualified person from voting. Instead, they say, it guards against vote fraud and heightens public confidence in the integrity of elections.
And yet….
In Georgia, whose initial law was enjoined by a judge and later replaced by a statute offering free IDs for the poor, the state estimated that 200,000 to 300,000 citizens lacked licenses. In Missouri, whose Supreme Court struck down its photo ID law, the estimate was 175,000 to 240,000. Rokita [the Indiana Secretary of State, a Republican] said his office did no such impact analysis before the passage of Indiana’s law.
When someone votes who is not eligible, then they reduce the value of my vote. Voter verification is necessary to assure that only legal votes are counted.
Another link on this issue: WSJ Opinion Journal – Voter-Fraud Showdown
Even modest in-person voter fraud creates trouble in close races. In Washington state’s disputed 2004 governor’s race, which was won by 129 votes, the election superintendent in Seattle testified in state court that ineligible felons had voted and votes had been cast in the name of the dead. In Milwaukee, Wis., investigators found that, in the state’s close 2004 presidential election, more than 200 felons voted illegally and more than 100 people voted twice. In Florida, where the entire 2000 presidential election was decided by 547 votes, almost 65,000 dead people are still listed on the voter rolls–an engraved invitation to fraud. A New York Daily News investigation in 2006 found that between 400 and 1,000 voters registered in Florida and New York City had voted twice in at least one recent election.
…in 2005, 18 of 21 members of a bipartisan federal commission headed by former President Jimmy Carter and former Secretary of State James Baker came out in support of photo ID requirements more stringent than Indiana’s. “Voters in nearly 100 democracies use a photo identification card without fear of infringement on their rights,” the commission stated. Mr. Carter feels strongly about voter fraud.
…the (Supreme Court) noted that anyone without an ID is by federal law always allowed to cast a provisional ballot that can be verified later. The court also noted that fraud “drives honest citizens out of the democratic process and breeds distrust of our government. Voters who fear their legitimate votes will be outweighed by fraudulent ones will feel disenfranchised.”
This is one of those issues you can go around and around on, but the facts just don’t support a “principled” position for voter ID. Simply, there isn’t real voter fraud. As most readers here know, most of the stuff Republicans have dredged up in support of their claims is phony registering. Illegal voting, however, almost never happens (several attorneys general lost their jobs for being unable to find and prosecute such cases). No one seriously argues that such voter ID laws prevent nearly as much fraud as legitimate voting. If my memory serves me, Rove’s hero Mark Hanna also felt that illegal voting had become a very pressing problem and his party (the Democrats) should put the onus on individuals to prove their citizenship. What a weird coincidence that this national problem would resurface under Rove’s watch. And it doesn’t take a genius to note that all the Republicans tearing their hair out about illegal voting would be singing a very different tune if this suppressed primarily Republican voters.
There are simply no documented cases of voter ID fraud. That’s one of the reasons that those US Attorneys were fired. They refused to play Rove’s game.
But there was election fraud and it was document. In 2002, John Sununu won the Senate Race in NH narrowly over Jean Shaheen. Since then several Sununnu aidea and NH GOP functionaries have plead guilty to voter fraud and tampering. Some are in jail.
Vote fraud is as old as the Democratic Party. With voter ID’s, dead people will no longer vote and other voters will quit doing it in alphabetical order. Are you saying, rlc, that has never happened? And, selected cases of vote fraud ignore the many of those committed by Democrats, which are often ignored by Democratic D.A.’s, Democratic judges, and the liberal media.
I want voter ID so that I’m comfortable of the control of vote fraud, whether or not anyone wants to admit that it happens.
Provide examples Woody. You can’t any more than the US Attorneys in Washington or New Mexico could find examples. But New Hampshire REPUBLICANS went to jail for shenanigans in 2002 and that will bite Sununu in the ass this year in his rematatch with Shaheen.
Thom Hartman of AIR AMERICA notes that his mother has not had a drivers license for thirty years and lacks a picture ID. Guess she’s SOL right? I mean the fact that this impacts the poor and minorities who tend to vote “D” has nothing to do with your concern, right?
And, selected cases of vote fraud ignore the many of those committed by Democrats, which are often ignored by Democratic D.A.’s, Democratic judges, and the liberal media.
“Selected” cases at least are real, as opposed to the ones that certainly appear to exist solely in your imagination.
rlc, my existence doesn’t revolve around providing you with information for which there is ample evidence and plenty of resources. If you are unable to find circumstances of Democratic vote fraud and try to hide behind requiring me to give examples so that you don’t have to face reality, then you’re likely inept and dishonest. Same with Randy.
However, examples in the WSJ article that I referenced are real and involve Democratic cheating. And, should I mention about the Democrats who sliced the tires of Republican get-out-the-vote vans in Wisconsin the night before an election?
However, examples in the WSJ article that I referenced are real and involve Democratic cheating.
No, you are presuming that it’s Democrats. All you have shown is that cheating appears to have taken place. Given that ballots are secret, you have neither proof that it was being done by Democrats nor that it was being done for the benefit of Democrats.
Left-wing, ACLU raised, Clinton appointed, Constitutionally challenged Justice Ginsburg is the only justice opposing Indiana’s voter ID law.
LINK: LAT Supreme Court Reporter Shies Away From Labeling Ginsburg Liberal
Of course, that last part gave her away–not Constitutonal consequences but political ones. How can you people stand her?
Randy, wake up. When the Democrats steal the electors in Wisconsin with phony votes and the governor of Washington is put into office with missing votes that continually turn up until she win, and you don’t see that, then you’re clueless. Even “Landslide Lyndon’s” partners in crime admitted to casting phony ballots, if you want an admission from the Democrats.
Woody,
Yet again you present nothing but innuendo tainted by your own bias.
Randy, your position presumes that there must be significant examples of vote fraud to justify controls. That’s about as stupid as a store saying that they don’t want any financial controls until someone embezzles a significant amount of money.
I want this law to be effective if for no other reason that I want assurance that illegal votes are not being cast because I want my vote worth an entire vote and not watered down by illegal ones. I once lived in a state where elections were won by Democrats by writing names off of tombstones.
If you want evidence of vote fraud rather than innuendo, refer to my comment #’s 1, 8, & 11, which contain examples that have been admitted or documented. If that doesnt’ work for you, then you’re just avoiding a discussion.
Woodyu,
I’m not doubting that there has been vote fraud, but you ascribe 100% of it in the examples you cite to the Democrats with absolutely no proof, other than your own bias.
Read comment 9 and stop blaming me for your poor comprehension skills.
Randy, it’s not bias when the cheating aids the Democrats. Just admit that you would rather nit-pick than engage in a discussion.
Woody,
We grown-ups ask for proof. You have provided zero to support your claims. Pound the table and try to change the focus all you wish, but your emperor has no clothes.
A little more truth to “truthiness.”